Senator Michael Bennet on Corruption, Collusion, and the Future of our Nation Come November
Senator Michael Bennet, a member of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, reflects on the Committee’s bipartisan report on Russia's interference in our elections, the US Government's response to prevent a repeat of 2016 this November, the details of Steve Bannon's indictment representative of the Trump Administration's serial corruption, and a recap of the Democratic National Convention.
Transcript:
Al Hunt: [00:00:00] And the podcast. Nice white parents reporter Hannah Joffey walk. You may know her from this American life started looking into this one school in her neighborhood. After her kids became school age in New York city, Hannah examines his public middle school traditionally filled with black and Brown students.
After a number of white families arrived. And then not satisfied. She fully understood what she was seeing. She went all the way back to the family of the school in the 1960s. And then up to the present day. Again, eventually Hunter realized she could put a name to what was getting in the way of making the school better.
All these years, white parents. Nice white parents is a fascinating, listen. That's deeply relevant today. It's made by serial productions, a New York times company. Same people who made the hit podcast, serial and S town, all episodes are now available. Wherever you do get your podcasts.
Hello, and welcome to a special edition of 2020 politics war rum with James Carville out in the Shenandoah. I'm Al here in Washington, we remain proud park because I think they're sticking with us, but the sign Institute at American university in Washington, someday, when this pandemic is over, we'll get back.
We have good show for you and all important week, the democratic national convention wrapped up. Uh, Steve Bannon was untidy. We'll talk about all that in a minute, but first I want to thank everyone. Who's subscribed to the show on Apple podcast, Stitcher, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Uh, this is why you subscribe.
So today's episode shows up in your inbox, even though you didn't expect it to right, but a big week. And they're really the piece to resist us. As they say in Paris will be Senator Michael Bennett. One of the. Greatest people in American politics and also a member of that Senate intelligence committee, which issued their rushing report.
Uh, uh, this week, James let's start with it. I am a crash. Uh, they wrapped up, um, it was overall I think, a very good convention for them. Um, you, I, I thought the Biden's speech was okay. You thought it was off the charts. Great. Most people agreed with you. I thought the Harris. Pick was off the charts. You thought it was.
Okay. I think it's most people agree with me. Let's combine merge the two and agree the Democrats came out in really good shape better than four years.
James Carville: [00:02:31] Yeah. I and I, the Harris pig came about and I expected, but her speech was not very good. Well, I think the Biden's speech accomplish this point, that speech accomplish more things in one speech.
Then I've seen in a long time and the main thing it accomplished, it just made the whole cognition issue look stupid. I mean, it just really did. I mean, I thought, um, he, he just stood and, and he delivered. And any day that ends with, you know, Steve and Donald Trump strategist arrested on 150 foot, $28 million boat, Bob postal, inspectors and ends would.
Joe Biden said, God bless our troops. If you're a Democrat and you complain about that day, you have something. That's not right.
Al Hunt: [00:03:24] We'll get to Steve Bannon in just a minute. Cause it is one hell of a story. But I think overall look, I thought some of it was schmaltzy, but I thought given what the Democrats had to do a virtual convention, which was hard, I could have done with a little bit less Hollywood.
Uh, but they had some wonderful clips. Uh, I thought the Biden grandchildren were just incredible. Uh, Stephan Curry, who was just great that 95 year old, a war veteran, uh, was just so authentic. And I think they did touch all the right notes. And one thing show James that I think four or five years ago, there were legitimate stories written that the Republicans had a much deeper bench than Democrats.
They had young congressional leaders, they had governors and the Democrats didn't have any kind of a bench. Well, boy, there was a bench display, uh, in Milwaukee and virtually, uh, and it's a pretty darn impressive bench.
James Carville: [00:04:24] It is. And I have them, Ron Brownstein yesterday. I gave him a quote that I thought the convention up in through Wednesday night could have been 20% more, 2018.
I think it chill out. Yeah, it happened. We were not as strong as we should be on the kitchen table issue, which was such so famous 2018 campaign. What I particularly liked about the Biden speech was there was a lot of 2018. And I think that corrected what I thought was busted. And I said 20% and overall, uh, I, you know, that was the seventh game.
All right. That's, that's what, that was it. You can take everything else that happened in that convention and edit altogether. And it doesn't amount to the importance of the Joe Biden speech.
Al Hunt: [00:05:16] Quite know that I agree. I think conventions leave you with impressed. Uh, and I think most people won't remember a whole lot of particulars two or three weeks from now, but I think the whole convention overall with some exception, I mean, the Obama's were off the charts too.
Uh, but I think overall, you know, and with the finale lines, but you you're left with an impression that this is a party ready to correct. Uh, the, uh, the terrible situation we're in today, ready to govern United more than any time in a long time. Uh, and that they're basically adults.
James Carville: [00:05:53] Yeah, I agree. But I'll just, we'll do, we'll just agree to disagree.
I think the, the crowning achievement was the Bible speak without that, that that's what made it would have. I did not. I thought the convention was pretty good, you know, till Thursday night. Then I went from pretty good to like really good. Jeff Nessbaum texted me. They had 247 at what they did logistically is something to admire.
I think that like 247 total speakers of which 49 were live, which is a, you know, I, people will go into Biden campaign, nursing Biden campaign that night. To some extent I wasn't. Well, certainly didn't have where's your campaign in the primary. Nobody can deny that. But what they did and were able to put together this convention was a, I think was to force course.
Al Hunt: [00:06:49] It was good. Yeah. I agree. Um, I don't look, uh, there's no way you can say that, uh, that we can overlook Michelle Obama's speech on Monday night or the former president on Wednesday night, they said predicates that were terribly important. Uh, and I think, uh, you know, were very persuasive and there were some other people too that did well.
Some not so well.
James Carville: [00:07:12] Again, but let's just agree to disagree without the Biden's speech to convention, wouldn't be nearly as successful. It is, but that's just my view and we could park anything on. Well, we, we disagreed
Al Hunt: [00:07:23] on the Hara. We disagreed on the Harris pick. We can just read on that. And as I say, we merged, we merged the two together and, uh, and we get something good.
Let's move to the, this what you cited a minute ago. Steve Bannon, it's an incredible story in so many ways, as you said, Arrest that the Trump confidant of one time arrested on the 150 foot yacht of a Chinese billionaire for a shakedown by the, by the Southern district of New York. This is the justice department under William Barr, supposedly.
And James, let me just make two quick points. I thought in the Nixon years when they, there were the four horsemen in pinstripes, John Mitchell, Bob Haldeman, John Ehrlichman, and Chuck Colson. Now, if you look back four years ago today, there are five people other than family who were closest politically to.
Donald Trump where Michael Flynn, Steve Bannon, Roger Stone, uh, Paul Manafort and Michael Cohen has her all have been indicted several or servant. This is the most corrupt administration in the history of America. And one final, quick point when William Barr tried to get rid of that us attorney in New York, who actually stood up to him, I suspect we're going to find out.
He knew this was coming and one can legitimately ask, was this a factor in what he wanted to do?
James Carville: [00:08:48] Well, there's all kinds of things. I think the first thing to remember here is this entire Trump, everything. It's all one giant grift. Alright, so let's think about the alleged crime, the indict. What did he do?
Right. They took the said we're going to, Abeta used a. Disabled veteran. All right. And who had a history of running things at his nature polyester prior to this involved in this. And they went to the very people that they claimed credibility would caring about. And audio is, you know, basically, you know, lower middle class whites who have a real sense of grievance and they just fleeced him.
I mean, it's just like his preachers. There were these old ladies. I mean, it, you know, you typically political crime. If somebody Felicia's an investment banker, you know, gets it, et cetera. That's not what they did. It's not what they did. They stole from the very people that they claimed to defend and promote it.
That's the amazing, I, you know, this day ended with. That started with bound getting arrested and ended with Joe Biden said, God bless our troops. You're going to have a better, I don't know Morris.
Al Hunt: [00:10:14] Well, I mean, I on the bankruptcy, right? And this was the guy who prayed it as the great populous. This was the guy who was anti wall street and he might work there, I'd say establishment.
Um, and this was just an absolute police job, uh, while sitting on a yacht. That's where they arrested him. I mean, it really is just
James Carville: [00:10:34] not.
Al Hunt: [00:10:35] Yes. A guy, a guy who had, who had fled rape charges in China, whatever you think of the Chinese government, this is a bad guy. And, uh, but, but also Trump of course, I mean, I thought people Trump was going to have to have to say, would you remind me which Steve, who, uh, as he distanced himself, one problem, they have one problem.
Not just was the closest they once had, but guess who plugged this project name? Donald Trump, as in jr.
James Carville: [00:11:04] And
Al Hunt: [00:11:05] then
James Carville: [00:11:07] the tape of Fox plugging the project.
Al Hunt: [00:11:09] Yeah. Yeah. I mean,
James Carville: [00:11:12] they didn't have much of that on the last night.
Al Hunt: [00:11:14] No, no, no. It's just for them, for, for, for this president, as he always does, uh, to walk away and said, man, I didn't approve of this.
What
James Carville: [00:11:22] course he
Al Hunt: [00:11:23] approved of it. I mean, it's just a, it's, it's a scam. He approved of a James because it was a scam and Trump loves scams.
James Carville: [00:11:32] Right? It, it, it, the whole thing attracts criminals, right? It just, you know, mother told you, and you're four years old, you know, birds of a feather flock together. So it's not just a trite saying the reason that people say that is because at the bottom of the day there's truth to it, there's truth to it in this air force bedroom.
Hasn't been, I think. Uh, I have to be double checked on this, but I recall reading a couple of places that this was kind of regular behavior for
Al Hunt: [00:12:05] him.
Well, the other thing is Steve Bannon knows a lot about Donald Trump and a lot of stuff that Donald Trump did during the campaign and elsewhere. And if it's the Southern district of New York, uh, and those are tough customers, they don't lose very many things, James. They really don't. And if they really, if they really have the goods on him, and if mr.
Bannon, I don't know, this will be the case, but if he starts to sing, uh, you know, you're going to hear that at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and of all the people know, obviously Manafort and stone were playing for a pardon and they had not sung, but, uh, Bannon, Bannon is a tougher customer, more interested in protecting his own ass and in protecting Trump.
James Carville: [00:12:55] Well, first of all, but we should get this guy on watching Daniel Goldman and peaking the council last night.
Al Hunt: [00:13:03] Right.
James Carville: [00:13:04] And he was making the same point. And in a Sunday, you know, if you get indicted by the Eastern district of Idaho, I'm not saying they're not really talented prosecutors that have dedicated people, anything, but if the last place you want to be invited, so there's New York, there went to San Angeles, study it, you know, Baron is going to have to.
Make a choice. You know, his lawyer is going to have to make a profit. And what is included in that profit is gonna determine mr. Patton's future to say the least. And I won't tell you his lawyer is explaining that to him today.
Al Hunt: [00:13:43] You go ahead. They don't,
James Carville: [00:13:44] they don't. The Baton is a top of that conspiracy.
They don't need any information on this scam. It van has other information that can aid other investigations, uh, then that there might be a way to work something out.
Al Hunt: [00:14:03] Yeah. There may be an let's not lose sight of the fact that this thing has been in the works for months. The attorney general was told about it as he's supposed to be when any, um, um, when the Southern district or any other district is bringing a big sensitive case.
And it appears, I don't know the exact timing during that time. He tried to cashier the U S attorney of the Southern district and bring in a Trump loyalist to replace him under a highly unusual circumstance. I mean, James, I'm sorry, I don't have to be a conspiracy theorist to say that. Just, that just smells
James Carville: [00:14:40] well.
Yeah, but we should try to get manual Goldman on the shelf.
Al Hunt: [00:14:45] Daniel. Goldman went, Daniel Goldman went to Sidwell friends and we've known the Goldmans for years. And he is, he is, he is terrific. I mean, despite that Sidwell friends, that
James Carville: [00:14:54] okay. He makes the point. You didn't go to Ascension Catholic and balancing bill losing him.
Al Hunt: [00:15:00] Not sorry. Sorry. I missed that one.
James Carville: [00:15:04] Ben and new in October that they were after him. Good as bank teller. Yeah. Alright. And they kept moving money around is if, you know, once you go to your lawyer and you say, look, I'm pretty sure I'm under investigation because the first thing that lawyer is going to tell you, I don't care who that lawyer is, she or he, or whatever, whatever that is, don't touch a thing.
Don't talk to anybody. Don't move any money around, just stay right where you are. And if anybody asks you anything, haven't talked to me. That's the number one thing that you're going to say and moving money around, they were trying to hide it. I appreciate they were trying to cover it up after the, they were under investigation in, how do you know you're under federal investigation?
This is just a human question. I mean, I know Amanda fell investigation. I know what I did. I don't think I'd be sitting on the back of a boat thinking coffee and, um, you know, in Connecticut, but that's just the way a guy operates with kind of, I'd be a little, he's going to find out how unpleasant this is.
Al Hunt: [00:16:23] Yes. Uh, I would, I would offer one caveat and that is that it's going to take months before this would ever go to a trial. And if as we both are, I think confident, uh, Donald Trump's gonna lose November 3rd, my guess is on November 4th. Uh, you're going to have to take out a whole
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:16:43] newspaper page to list all the pardons
Al Hunt: [00:16:45] he's going to, uh,
James Carville: [00:16:47] which, you know, the Southern district.
I just, that you, that there's some state laws that were violated by
Al Hunt: [00:16:58] them. Maybe there may be,
James Carville: [00:17:00] and I guarantee you. They know, the state always had a violator.
Al Hunt: [00:17:06] There's no question. I mean, that's the problem that Trump has with the Manhattan da, but you're right. If there's a state law, there's no way in the world.
You can pardon someone from that.
James Carville: [00:17:16] No, and I don't know that the nature of the crime and I mean, it was just delicious at the postal inspectors arrested
Al Hunt: [00:17:24] him. Oh, Oh, well, you know, maybe that was standard procedure. But I, I, um, I sometimes thought maybe the New York FBI. Would be the, uh, uh, apprehending agency.
But I think there's this suspicion that that's a Trump enclave fairly or unfairly, but whatever it was one it's one hell of a story.
Hey James, you know, in the New Hampshire primary, which seems like 17 years ago, you embrace Michael Bennet's candidacy at a wonderful Walker's Manchester event. I wrote a column saying he was no more qualified. There was no more qualified candidate in the country. Boy, it really shows how powerful we are politically journalistically, but I tell you, Davis, we were right.
There is no more thoughtful member of Congress than Colorado's Michael Bennett. And he is a member of the Senate intelligence committee, which just released a bipartisan report. Detailing extensive 2016 contacts between chump Trump operatives and the Russians as Putin work to manipulate the election to help elect Trump welcome Senator from Colorado.
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:18:40] I have to say how much I appreciate the fact that both you guys noticed that I was running for president and James. Thank you for coming to New Hampshire. That was the high watermark of a year long campaign. And I really.
James Carville: [00:18:54] It was, it was really fun. I had a good time. I feel good about what I did, man. It was like a took up, you know, people said, Brian, you, it, I said just because I wanted to write not 75 and you want to do something, you better do it.
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:19:08] My, my kids. So I told them where to go out into the crowd and it, uh, it made them feel like we had missed the boat on what these campaign events look like. But next time we'll hear it. We'll get
it.
James Carville: [00:19:24] Yes. Right. Go ahead.
Al Hunt: [00:19:26] We're going to rev him up. Um, let me ask you about this intelligence report, Senator, you know, it's clear that the Trump campaign manager shared pony information with a Russian intelligence agent, which presumably helped the Russian G GRU interfere in the election.
Uh, that's been documented and where they did it selectively. Uh, the, uh, Trump conciliary Roger Stone directed the leaking of Russian hacks at Democrat democratic emails. I don't, I'm not a lawyer. I don't know how you define it, Senator, but that's sure as hell sounds like collusion. To me,
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:20:01] it sounds like collusion to me too.
And we said that actually, the Democrats are in a piece that we wrote at the end of the report, but I think what's really important is that this bipartisan report all five volumes of it. And I believe unanimously. Uh, recounts a, uh, a Russian conspiracy to interfere in our election that in 2016 and electo from, and anybody who cares about the democracy, whether they're Republican or Democrat needs to care about that.
And let me tell you one last thing. They're not relenting the Russians or seeing. Uh, president Trump's denial of what they did in 2016 as an invitation to continue to interfere, uh, the Chinese and others. They're looking at ways and then they're variant. You can see how horrible we are. I mean, you know, we will woke up the day after election day and couldn't have confidence in the results because somebody that manipulated those results, that's going to be a serious, that'll be a really dark day in democracy.
Al Hunt: [00:21:05] You know, you're so right. And I was initially really encouraged by the bipartisan nature of this unanimous. As you said, the Republicans on your committee, unlike the Devin Nunez and Ron Johnson's the Trump sycophants. Uh, they signed this report yet, right afterwards, Marco Rubio said the report shows there's.
Absolutely no evidence of any collusion between the Russians and Trump. Now, you know, if this is going to be your talking point, he said, she said, I'm not worried about the past. I think it's clear, but it really makes it much harder to put up those warning flags and do something about what they're doing again this year.
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:21:43] That's right. It makes it hard to defend. I will say that, um, We're much better protected today. We're in 2016, we were unaware and not withstanding what the Trump administration is saying. Or without Trump is saying. The men and women of our intelligence agencies are working overtime to try to defeat the threat.
But what's really important though. I think as well is for the American people to understand that we were victims of Russian propaganda in 2016, I actually published the book sort of self published it during the, during the presidential election. That's just filled with the Russian propaganda that they produced.
And, you know, obviously first of all, the Russians are incredible. Propaganda is going back. To the Soviet union. But if you look at this stuff, it's the moat. I've got it here. In my hand, it's the most racist homophobic. Anti-immigrant anti Muslim pro Muslim. They took both sides of almost all of these issues, but the point is all they wanted to do is divide us.
And for an entire year, we didn't even know it was Russian propagandists. So think about what that says about the state of our democratic discourse. We spent an entire year of being attacked, but one power. And we can't distinguish it between our, you know, from our political debate. We need to do a better job in order to bake.
And we got to keep the Russians out of our elections.
Al Hunt: [00:23:12] Senator. I said we were going to look forward, but one thing it just, you know, continues to bother me. I think the case against Trump on, on the Ukrainians down a foreign leader to dig up dirt on a political opponent was a persuasive one, an impeachable offense, but that's not nearly as serious as what happened with the Russians in 2016.
Did the Democrats make a mistake? Not jumping on the Russian. Yeah. Uh, as an impeachment issue in 2019,
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:23:41] I think that, you know, I, I'm trying to think back to that Monday morning, quarterback it, but I, I think, um, the offense is that he was, uh, impede for, and that we had a trial on and it. Were impeachable offenses, especially in the, it takes the, what we've since learned, which terrible about what happened in, in that instance was Mitch McConnell, blockade of evidence and testimony that was available for the senators to have to at least confront in the Senate chamber.
And because, you know, he did his usual stonewalling protect from. The American people were denied. The ability to hear evidence, all of us knew was, you know, was, would confirm the impeachable allegations that were made. So yeah, no, a further reflection. I think of how broken our democratic institutions are and why, and why McConnell has really been a toxic force in gender and politics for his entire career.
Why it's time for him to no longer be the majority? I don't think he will be, by the way. I think we're going to win the Senate
James Carville: [00:24:55] before we start out with a Ryan people. Right. We did run third and
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:25:01] I will tell you that there are people that were running for president who noticed that and called me. So,
James Carville: [00:25:11] yeah. Yep. The Mueller report, which some people think was actually more thorough than it's given credit for, did not look into financial transaction in Russia. And it wasn't your charge in its intelligence committee, but it wasn't what it was supposed to do. But it did. I think a really good job establishing a lot of facts.
The UN looked at part of this is the Trump Russia financial connections. Do you think anybody is going to go forward? We're going to look at that. I mean, the statute of limitations are not run close on that. And what would be, who would it be to propolis, to arcade, to look into that? I
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:25:52] think we do need to look into that.
And I think that, um, you know, if there's, um, the, um, Uh, and I think the proper authority to look into that probably would be the United States justice department. Um, maybe the New York state prosecutors, but I always a big fan of president Obama's for many, many reasons, still am a big fan of this. But one of the things that I always worried about was when he said on a rock, that it was time for us to turn to pay.
And we never, as a result of that, we never. No, why we went into Iraq, the mistakes we made in Iraq, the fact that we were there for 20 years and also in Afghanistan, never really confronted it. And I think that ignore what Trump has done near effect that will be an imprimatur of, you know, behavior that should be unacceptable for anybody to be eligible, to run for president much less be president.
So I, I hope we're not going to turn the page. You know, obviously it shouldn't be, we don't want our country to be a country like Pakistan, where, when you're in power, you, you, you do what you want. And when you're out of power, you get prosecuted. That's not something any of us would want, but
James Carville: [00:27:10] not to mention, not following up in jail.
And some of these wall street people, financial crimes.
The only thing that would even we have, we still vote providing, but the one thing, yeah, he could say that would really deflate me would be, you know, we're going to look forward after I'm elected and we're not going to spend time revisiting the past. No, I mean, you put somebody there in until people have accountability.
It, you know, wait your superintendent, schools and Denver public school system. You know, a four year old has got to be accumbent, we've got to catch this kid. We gotta make sure, you know, retested him. You have grades. If he messes up in class, you've got to be corrected. And there has to be, it was not accountability on the rock wall.
There was not accountability on the financial crisis. And I think it undermined a lot of faith in people and there has to be accountability and there's no getting around and bite them have said to his credit that. You know, he's not going to stand in a way. And I liked that and I hope, I hope that's the fact.
Yeah,
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:28:15] I agree with that. I was telling now, before we got on the phone that I've spent the last three days in the most rural part of Colorado groups, Aleida, still more to creed the Lake city to dust and ended up in crisp. He's been, not democratic stronghold by the way, but, um, was meeting with local elected officials, many other people who are dealing with the probate crisis, dealing with the economic crisis.
As many of them call them more of them, more Republicans than Democrats. And one of the things I was saying to them, cause they always say, how are you guys as screwed up as yours messed up, you know, even passed another bill. If we, uh, if we held our elected officials in Washington accountable to the same standard, we hold our local elected officials, our County commissioners, our school superintendents, we'd be fine.
But over the last 20 years, we've stopped doing that. And, um, and I think both, you know, the kind of legal accountability you're talking about political accountability. The accountability that we've gotta figure out how to enjoy back into our system, that we've lost as a result of the decline of daily journalism and investigative journalism.
The democracy just doesn't work very well. If you don't have accountability and it isn't a standard of behavior. That requires you to do something other than come home and say, yeah, sorry, I didn't get anything done. And just blame the other side. We need, we need to get to a place where people actually have to get something done.
Al Hunt: [00:29:56] Okay. Just as a quicker side. Yeah. I mean, I agree with you both so much. And I think the lack of accountability on both the financial crisis and the Iraq war was a factor in Donald Trump's victory in 2016. And so. There's a, there's a real consequence for that. Uh, you know, I'm lucky and the mother report had its deficiencies, but a lot of it had to do with the way it was mischaracterized and distorted right away by the attorney general William Barr who has become a great Trump loyalist.
Do you have any fear as an October surprise that this attorney general might spring
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:30:33] off deeply worried about all kinds of October surprises? And let me just say on that, to that point, Donald Trump can be reelected, you know, and people better understand that a lot of people thought it wouldn't get elected the first time.
Like he's going to stop at nothing. And I'm sure, you know, his attorney general will stop it for nothing to try to keep him there. I worry a lot about what happens if we lose one of our Supreme court justices and what, what that's gonna mean for even after an election where Donald Trump loses, what, what do they do in the lame duck session to manipulate the government in their interests?
And, um, So we have a lot, there's a lot. This is a moment when the American people need to be vigilant. And as president Obama said the other day, you know, the whole notion of I alone can fix it, which is what Trump ran on is completely antithetical to who we are as Americans, that the democracy only works.
Let me say it this way. The democracy works poorly when people or individuals are not involved in that. And it worked better when we are, and there's going to have to be a ton of oversight. From the house of representatives between now and the swearing in of the next president, from the free press and from the people they're going to stop.
And nothing
in rural Colorado are terrified about what Trump's doing to the post office, not just because of the voting issue over that concerns. My state is one of the most successful male voting States in the country. But we're also terrified that they're not going to get your medicine,
Al Hunt: [00:32:15] put your intelligence hat on for one second, Senator and an Axios interview.
The president said he spoke to Trump and he never brought up. The significant charges that the Russians were paying bounties to kill American soldiers in Afghanistan. What was the reaction to the private reaction to American intelligence?
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:32:36] It's sickening. I mean, it's a sickening thing. You know, he even said it was even worse than that.
He said the president said they would have no reason to because the Russians have no interest in Afghanistan. I mean just the most ignorant. Idiotic. I mean, and, and reprehensible comments, by the way. And I, I think people need to understand this is that Hooten, the narrative and the Chinese or the North Koreans.
Nothing could make them happier than Donald Trump being reelected because they can prosecute your case on the world stage. If Donald Trump is our president, it's going to be hard for him to do that with Joe. Well,
James Carville: [00:33:22] let's go to politics. Uh, how do you see the Hickenlooper gardener race shaping up if my first grade and my second parish, do we have a chance for any house pick up in Colorado?
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:33:34] Let me answer the second one first. We've got the third congressional district where the incumbent Republican was defeated by a Trump
A candidate who, whose claim to fame is that you wear as a gun on the outside of her jeans and that you refused to close down her business. When her restaurant, when the governor said we needed to be closed. And so I do think we have a real chance there it's a tough district. Uh, but, uh, but it's not a, it's not a district.
You know, the, I think that's going to be supported well by somebody with that kind of ideology. We've got a good candidate. Diane mates is her name running against her. So that would be the one pickup. The other ones we'll we'll hold all the polling that I've seen until now has been the double digit over Gardner.
There's nothing that we, we are taken for granted, you know, Hickenlooper's gonna run through a run through the tape here and, uh, but I think you'll win. And I think James. There's a real chance that day after election day, we're gonna wake up and discover that we've got two democratic senators from Colorado, from New Mexico to, from Arizona, to, from Nevada to, from Montana.
That would be an unbelievable, uh, new democratic, uh, wall in the, in the Rocky mountain West that I not only, um, It speaks well of our potential electoral success, but I like the complexion that's too, just for, uh, for our politics and for the democratic
James Carville: [00:35:16] party right now, I would throw, it's not what you call a Rocky mountain state, but they've got big, big mountains.
I would throw Alaska in that miss mint mix. I think we got a real chance. I've been really helping these guys.
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:35:31] I think we have a chance there too. No, we're looking very good in Maine. I think we've got a chance to know you got a chance in Georgia,
South Carolina, North Carolina looks really good. And Arizona says, I said, so, you know, We can win all those races or at least almost all of them. We can change the,
James Carville: [00:35:58] but I'm picking one point where I got you. Uh, the most interesting Senate counterpart of this cycle is in Louisiana, right? Adrian Perkins is 37 years old.
He grew up in the most impoverished neighborhood Shreveport. He went to West point. He was the first black brigade commander three tours combat. We won a bronze star. He went back to Harvard law when he was president of his class. He came back to Shreveport, beat an incumbent may of two to one right now.
Okay. The latest poll I saw has Trump beating Biden 50 to 43. Alright, aye. This is a long shot. It's definitely, I would certainly not suggest to anybody it's a toss up or even a lean. But this is the best candidate I've seen this party put forward in their third that's in their thirties, maybe in my lifetime.
And I'm going to help Adrian every step of the way, because just like I helped Michael Bennett, I just stuff. I get mine. Teeth into something and I believe it's the right thing to do. I'm just going to, I'm just going to pursue it and I'm going to pursue this
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:37:08] part. I'm glad you mentioned the word, James.
James Carville: [00:37:13] Yes, sir. Yes, sir.
Al Hunt: [00:37:14] Well, you know, picking up on that and the boy James puts his teeth in something, get out of the way, because he's a force as you know, Michael, but you know, I'm looking at what you just said. And if Mark Kelly wins and John Hickenlooper wins and Steve, Steve Bullock wins and Cal Cunningham and Sara Gideon.
For all the talk about the left wing pressures on Joe Biden. When you take that, that group is like you win. And the 2018 house members who won that really is a dominant, moderate, progressive wing that is going to be in sync with most of the Biden administration.
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:37:50] Oh, totally agree. Or the question for us is, do we want to actually have a governing majority?
If we want to have a governing majority? Then we have to win purple States in the middle of the country. And we will this time, the only way we're going to give the States back is if, you know, if we have an agenda that doesn't. No momentum. You know, some people look at this and they say, Oh, we better get done what we need to get done in the first 10 minutes because no president can do anything after that.
I mean, James knows how hard it is to get anything done, no matter when you're first, no matter what period, but I believe there is. A real opportunity to build political momentum by, you know, dramatically changing the tax code. So we're taxing wealth and we're giving the middle class in the country, a real tax break, paid family and medical raising the minimum wage, creating universal healthcare with a public option.
I do it more on housing security, retirement, having a serious plan on climate change that actually drives our economy for, you know, meeting the unmet need for early childhood education in this country, doing something for the 70% of kids. Who, uh, who graduates from high school, but don't go on to college.
That's different from free college. What can we do to put those kids in the position to earn a living wage? When they graduate immigration reform infrastructure, tackling inequality, dealing with mass incarceration. Reforming our campaign. What I just threw out to you Al and I don't have any monopoly on wisdom here, but to me that's an agenda.
That's 75% of the American people will support. And that's the basis for 20 years of progressive change in this country. And that's where I think we ought to be focused, not just because I think we'll be successful politically, but because. More important than that. We'll actually be able to put an agenda down that will be as progressive as anything in the Teddy Roosevelt era or the, or the Lyndon Johnson they're even more progressive.
And frankly that's what's needed today. You
James Carville: [00:40:03] know, one thing is remind the Clinton economic plan, which causation correlation after password, the greatest. And most broad-based economic boom we've had in this country in the last 50 years. That's just a fact, the Obama Obamacare health plan, which led to until Trump got president, I think expansion of health, health insurance is something like 20 million people were all passed by one vote and not just cast the deciding vote we're from the same state and that's okay.
They was
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:40:38] Nebraska,
James Carville: [00:40:39] right. 18% of the United States elects 52 senators. And these people that urge us to have an urban centric, Uber progressive, you know, type of agenda. And when you say, look man eight, and they just needed to just stumble. I just brought muttering around and we'll change the constitution.
You can do no such thing. All right. And you have to. You have to go campaign patients like Eastern, Colorado. All right. You're not going to carry them, but you can do, you know, Holly, Colorado, where our, one of the great people of our lifetime governor Roy Romer came from, and when this party starts turning its back on certain segments of voters, it, it believes too disastrous consequences.
I
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:41:29] think I grew that I spent, Oh, by the way, you don't have to attribute back on anybody. We got it. I live in a state, which has, and I'm very proud of this fact. We have passed the first modern police accountability reform in a mirror. Yeah. It's the, basically the same bill that Cory Booker and cobble interest and I, and others supported in the Senate and it passed here amazingly with bipartisan support it.
Wasn't just Democrats. On the one hand on the neck. On the other hand, I'm spending all next week in Eastern, Colorado on the Eastern plain, you know, internees where no matter what I do, I'll never get more than 30% of the vote, even though I'm on the ag committee, even though. Spent a lot of time working together on stuff, but you can't lose them by 80%.
You're going to win. And that, to me, that's the amazing opportunity to Joe Biden has your incredible opportunity can come later, is that because Donald Trump and Mitch McConnell are so far outside of the mainstream of conventional American political thought. That we have the chance to be able to go to Nebraska, for example, Jane, and make the case that our tax policy is a hell of a lot better for farmers and ranchers than anything for them.
We have a chance to go to Iowa and make the case that we've got a path toward universal health care. That actually makes sense to people in their living rooms rather than. On talking points on the cable tellers, we've got the chance to make a case on climate change that I think can run the table in terms of what we need to do to drive, uh, economic growth and job growth in the 21st.
Century and we need it. We obviously need above all else to have a set of policies that lift working people's wages in this country. And if we can do that, that's going to be popular and red parts of the country and blue parts of the country. And as I said, I think. We could end up with a governing majority for a very long time.
The shame would be we fail to do it, you know, at a moment when Trump and the people that have given him covered throughout the entire time he's been president have governed in the most irresponsible factor of anybody in my life, including Richard Nixon, you know, and anybody else.
Al Hunt: [00:44:00] Oh, yeah, Nixon did some good.
This guy didn't know. Good. Uh, we've more than kept you as Michael Bennett. I can't tell you how much I appreciate it also. I, you know, let me tell you what else I find exciting a new administration, but also Michael Bennett playing that kind of role in the United States Senate 2021,
James Carville: [00:44:19] one final point I want to make, and that is we're facing a disastrous hurricane season and believe it or not the best.
Hurricane scientists and predictors are located in Fort Collins, Colorado at Colorado state university. No one would think that, but they are the gold standard of predictions of what's going to happen in storm season, coming from the foothills of the Rocky mountains.
Senator Michael Bennet: [00:44:47] We're very proud of that. We're also, we also have the nation's largest repository in Fort Collins as well.
I was yesterday at the Rocky mountain biological laboratory, uh, right outside of Colorado, where they're doing incredibly interesting research on climate and what it's doing to our water than other point. We have a great opportunity to engage farmers and ranchers in this discussion because they, more than anybody else know what's happening to their water because of climate change.
And they know they can't pass their form of law there. Or their kid or their grandkids things continue the way they're continuing, but somebody's talking to them to make a difference. So, anyway, I want to say, I love you and James, anything you ever need from me? I will do forever.
I hope. All right.
Al Hunt: [00:45:52] Great. James. I know you have to run, uh, but we have two shows, man. We may want, want to make a habit of this. Uh, this was so good today, but I want to
James Carville: [00:46:02] go ahead. They had just done a lot of things in my life. And that's one of the books. That's one of the most proud of proud of mom. If I have my lights on
Al Hunt: [00:46:12] with, with Jess, cause one of the best people I've ever known in American politics.
Uh, but I want to thank everybody for listening to 2020 politics were run foul of the show. On Twitter at politics war room, email, his politics were rum, uh, at gmail.com. That's politics were rum@gmail.com. And thanks for subscribing, please rate the show. Very favorably hope a five star review. We'll be back next week in the middle of the Republican convention.
Uh, and you never know of a shot, but we're going to have,
James Carville: [00:46:42] we're going to talk
Al Hunt: [00:46:43] about Republicans next week and you can count on us doing our best to entertain and inform you. I want everybody to stay safe and healthy and we'll talk to you next week.